The Symbolic World

"Ancient people knew the sky the way that we know the highways around our cities."
Today's podcast is a bit different. Deacon Seraphim Rohlin is here to introduce you to our new Symbolic World Course presenter, Joshua Sturgill. Together they discuss ancient cosmology, symbolism, and the meaning, power, and dangers of observing the night sky. They discuss pagan views on this, Biblical astronomy, the reservations of the church fathers, and modernity's determinism on the one hand, and confusion on the other hand. I hope you enjoy this conversation and will join us for Joshua's course.

YouTube version: https://youtu.be/fQY6AyE1n1c

NEW COURSE: The Art of Imitating Heaven: Structure and Meaning in Ancient Cosmology By Joshua Sturgill
What is heaven? Where is it? For ancient people, the answer was obvious: simply look up at the night sky. For them, to see the stars and planets was to see the face of the divine. Christianity, too, understood the visible sky as the realm of unfallen creation. What does this belief mean, and why was it lost?
🗓 Live classes are on Sundays at 5-6:30pm Eastern Time, starting February 1st through March 8th, 2026.
💰 Price: $150 USD
⏰🐥 DON'T MISS OUT! UNTIL FEBRUARY 1ST YOU CAN GET THE EARLY BIRD SPECIAL OF 15% OFF! Discount automatically applied at checkout.
Register now: https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/the-art-of-imitating-heaven

Timestamps:
00:00 - Coming up
01:00 - Intro music
01:24 - Introduction
04:15 - Recover cosmology
08:32 - Symbolism and cosmology
12:43 - The Greeks: Pythagoras and Plato
14:39 - Other traditions
16:07 - Criticisms against astronomy
21:28 - How astrology worked
25:24 - A concrete example
26:57 - What does spring mean?
30:47 - Christmas
33:43 - The Orthodox position
37:22 - Governed by natural laws
45:55 - For the ancients
59:30 - Architectural astronomy
01:01:43 - Technology and teaching
01:05:41 - Course info

💻 Website and blog: http://www.thesymbolicworld.com
🔗 Linktree: https://linktr.ee/jonathanpageau 
🔒 BECOME A PATRON: https://thesymbolicworld.com/subscribe 
Our website designers: https://www.resonancehq.io/ 
My intro was arranged and recorded by Matthew Wilkinson: https://matthewwilkinson.net/

In this interview, I sat down with Jean-Philippe Marceau—author of Post-Reductionist Christianity, our very first theory book at Symbolic World Press—to discuss his surprising and widely praised new Symbolic World article on the emerging global demographic crisis.

We discuss the falling birth rates and all its symbolic, scriptural, political, economic, and technological implications and causes. JP’s article likens today’s demographic collapse to the biblical Flood, looking at the dangers of both progressive dissolution and a reactionary overcorrection, proving the fact that the future belongs to those who build families grounded in meaning and tradition.

YouTube version: https://youtu.be/SBrTYadO3kE

Check out JP’s article, ‘Is This the Flood? Is Babel Next?’: https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/content/is-this-the-flood-is-babel-next

JP's book: https://store.thesymbolicworld.com/products/post-reductionist-christianity-a-way-out-of-the-meaning-crisis
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COURSE: The Quest for the Holy Grail, with Dr. Martin Shaw

Register now and get a FREE ebook of Dr. Martin Shaw's Snowy Tower: Parzival and the Wet Black Branch of Language!

In the dark heart of January, when the nights are long and the world draws close, Dr. Martin Shaw returns to the Symbolic World to tell one of the greatest stories of the Medieval imagination: Parzival and the Holy Grail.
From Monday through Friday, January 12–16, 2026, one of the world's great living storytellers will unspool the medieval epic that Joseph Campbell called the epicenter of Western myth. He’ll be lighting his fire, puffing a cigar, sipping on a whisky, and letting one of the greatest stories of all time lead us where it must.
Clear your evenings. Put another log on the fire. This is the storytelling event of the year.

🗓 Live classes will be over 5 consecutive days, January 12th-16th at 12pm-2pm EST
💰 Price: $160 USD (Involved patrons qualify for 10% off, apply code at checkout.)
All recordings will be made available on the same day.
Register today: https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/the-quest-for-the-holy-grail 
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Timestamps:
00:00 - Coming up
00:53 - Intro music
02:20 - Introduction to Demography and Its Significance
05:15 - Genetics and Political Ideologies
08:26 - Biblical Parallels: The Flood and Modern Society
11:24 - The Consequences of the Sexual Revolution
14:34 - Historical Patterns: Rome and Its Decline
17:56 - The Watchers
20:18 - Population and the WW2 Consensus
22:25 - The Impact of Cultural and Religious Practices
25:29 - The Challenge of Economic Systems
29:49 - The Only Way Out

💻 Website and blog: http://www.thesymbolicworld.com
🔗 Linktree: https://linktr.ee/jonathanpageau 
🔒 BECOME A PATRON: https://thesymbolicworld.com/subscribe 
Our website designers: https://www.resonancehq.io/ 
My intro was arranged and recorded by Matthew Wilkinson: https://matthewwilkinson.net/

In this conversation, I sit down with storyteller and mythologist Martin Shaw to explore the Holy Grail. We talk about desire and longing, failure and mercy, chivalry and the feminine, and why the Grail stories continue to be relevant across centuries.

YouTube version: https://youtu.be/3qDkPUsle3M

COURSE: The Quest for the Holy Grail with Dr. Martin Shaw
In the dark heart of January, when the nights are long and the world draws close, Dr. Martin Shaw returns to Symbolic World Courses for an intensive week-long journey to tell one of the greatest stories of the Medieval imagination: Parzival and the Holy Grail.
Register now: https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/the-quest-for-the-holy-grail 
Cost: $160 USD
Dates of live course: January 12-16, 2026
Time: 12 PM-2 PM EST, except for Lecture 3 (January 14) which will be at 4PM-6PM EST

Links:
-Pre-order Martin Shaw’s upcoming book, Liturgies of the Wild, to get an exclusive chapter: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/741189/liturgies-of-the-wild-by-martin-shaw/ 
-Martin’s other books, including Snowy Tower: https://drmartinshaw.com/books/ 

Events:
-February 13-15, 2026, Orthodox Christian Arts Festival (Praise for the Beauty) in Texas, with speakers including Martin Shaw and Deacon Seraphim Richard Rohlin: https://www.orthodoxartsfestivaldfw.com/ 
-January 27, 2026, London, The Temenos Academy. Seeing the Patterned World: the Cosmos as Layered Microcosms, a talk by Jonathan Pageau with Dr. Martin Shaw in the chair. £10 General Admission. The Art Workers' Guild, 6 Queen Square, London, WC1N 3AT. Doors open at 6.10 pm, lecture begins at 6.30 pm. https://www.temenosacademy.org/events-programme/seeing-the-patterned-world 

Some other links of things mentioned:
-Jonathan and Dcn Seraphim’s recent course on Dante’s Paradiso: https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/dantes-paradiso
-Jonathan’s analysis of Sir Gawain and the Green Knight: Part 1: https://youtu.be/Rg5RDZ7mMKo  and Part 2: https://youtu.be/1ch1T24-W7Q 
-The Monks and Pirates discussion with Andrew Gould: https://youtu.be/WjMadP6DScM 
-Universal History: The American Religion episode: https://youtu.be/0_RKBPaQAyk 

Timestamps:
00:00 - Coming up
00:32 - Intro music
02:00 - The cost of conversion
05:49 - What is the Grail
10:05 - Other hints of the Grail
15:30 - To remain veiled
17:45 - Who the stories are for
19:42 - The place of chivalry
24:46 - The Holy Virgin
29:31 - Longing
34:12 - Weakness has a seat at the table
36:48 - Liturgies of the wild
43:42 - Christianity in publishing

💻 Website and blog: http://www.thesymbolicworld.com
🔗 Linktree: https://linktr.ee/jonathanpageau 
🔒 BECOME A PATRON: https://thesymbolicworld.com/subscribe 
Our website designers: https://www.resonancehq.io/ 
My intro was arranged and recorded by Matthew Wilkinson: https://matthewwilkinson.net/

In this video I discuss the persistence of the idea that Christmas was "stolen" by Christians from the pagans, or that it's secretly still pagan. Merry Christmas everyone. Christ is born!

YouTube version: https://youtu.be/uh6rhiTrTnk
Christmas symbolism playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLVX4HUUPrIY9MeGP5IILeRzu62Q1NPT4C

NEW COURSE: The Quest for the Holy Grail with Dr. Martin Shaw
In the dark heart of January, when the nights are long and the world draws close, Dr. Martin Shaw returns to Symbolic World Courses for an intensive week-long journey to tell one of the greatest stories of the Medieval imagination: Parzival and the Holy Grail.
Register now: https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/the-quest-for-the-holy-grail 
Cost: $160 USD
Dates of live course: January 12-16, 2026
Time: 12 PM-2 PM EST, except for Lecture 3 (January 14) which will be at 4PM-6PM EST

💻 Website and blog: http://www.thesymbolicworld.com
🔗 Linktree: https://linktr.ee/jonathanpageau 
🔒 BECOME A PATRON: https://thesymbolicworld.com/subscribe 
Our website designers: https://www.resonancehq.io/ 
My intro was arranged and recorded by Matthew Wilkinson: https://matthewwilkinson.net/

In this conversation, I speak with British psychiatrist, neuroscientist, and author Dr. Iain McGilchrist about intelligence, mental illness, and AI.

Original YouTube version: https://youtu.be/DRtpKyKJcss
Get Dr. McGilchrist’s books: https://channelmcgilchrist.com/home/ 

APPLICATIONS OPEN: Ralston seeks 25 students with the curiosity and courage to find light in the darkness. Our one-year MA in the Humanities begins with two months learning Ancient and Modern Greek in Greece, before moving to beautiful Savannah, GA. Full and partial scholarships are available. The deadline for priority consideration is December 18, 2025. Visit https://www.ralston.ac/humanities-ma

NEW COURSE: The Quest for the Holy Grail with Dr. Martin Shaw
In the dark heart of January, when the nights are long and the world draws close, Dr. Martin Shaw returns to Symbolic World Courses for an intensive week-long journey to tell one of the greatest stories of the Medieval imagination: Parzival and the Holy Grail.
Catch the early bird sale of 15% off if you register before midnight December 19: https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/the-quest-for-the-holy-grail 
Cost: $160 USD
Dates of live course: January 12-16, 2026
Time: 12 PM-2 PM EST, except for Lecture 3 (January 14) which will be at 4PM-6PM EST

Timestamps:
00:00 Coming up
00:43 Intro music
01:07 Introduction to Ralston College and Its Mission
10:57 The Impact of Artificial Intelligence on Society
21:02 Intelligence and Consciousness
30:57 The Dangers of Alien Intelligence
39:17 Understanding Addiction and Mental Illness
46:04 Possession and Mental Health: A New Perspective
52:11 The Left Hemisphere and Its Malign Influence
01:03:37 AI: The Modern Sorcerer's Apprentice
01:11:11 All We Can Do

💻 Website and blog: http://www.thesymbolicworld.com
🔗 Linktree: https://linktr.ee/jonathanpageau 
🔒 BECOME A PATRON: https://thesymbolicworld.com/subscribe 
Our website designers: https://www.resonancehq.io/ 
My intro was arranged and recorded by Matthew Wilkinson: https://matthewwilkinson.net/